Cracks in keel joint on Sun Odyssey 35

[bobtheboatman]

Hi,

I am fairly new to sailing, having only had a boat a short time.
I am close to buying a Jeanneau Sun Odyssey 35 from 2006 second hand from a yacht broker.

But as I inspected the boat a found that the sealant in the joint between the keel en the hull was falling of, leaving the iron exposed. The iron was rusty.

My concern is if the rust could have 'attacked' the entire keel and keel bolts.

However the keel bolts looked fine from above.

Have anybody on this forum experienced the same, and is it something that should concern me. 
Looking at other boats at the sellers particular yard, it seemed like a common issue.

I only took this one picture (unfortunately), but it showed the same pattern all around the keel.

Cant get the right orientation of the picture - the keel is 'sticking out' to the right.





I saw a few other threads on this topic, but in both cases it seemed there was a gap between the keel and hull, which does not seem to be the case here.

Any inputs is appreciated. 

I have not have the boat surveyed, and was originally not planing to do so. But it might be a bad place to save 1000 euro. 

[Don Reaves]

I would definitely recommend a survey, even if it seems expensive. The surveyor will be able to tell you whether the rust can be cleaned up easily, with the sealant replaced, or if it will be necessary to drop the keel to inspect further and do more extensive repairs. The surveyor may well identify other problems that should be corrected before the sale. If repairs are indicated, the price should be lowered to account for the work.

I have a 2004 SO 35, and the sealant at the keel joint is in near-perfect condition. My boat was built in France and shipped to the USA, where the dealer assembled the hull and keel. Obviously, my dealer did a good job with the sealant. Perhaps this was not done so well with the boat you are looking at.

Good luck,

Don

[bobtheboatman]

Hi Don,

Thanks for your answer. Much appreciated! 

I have now updated with a foto.

I think you are right, that I should involve a surveyor. 
But in this particular case I am unsure how a surveyor can actually see how bad it is, without remiving the keel.

Any thoughts on this?

[Tafika II]

The condition is not good. I would, as Don suggested, definitely get a full survey on the boat. It will be worth the money and peace of mind.

[zaphod]

Certainly have a professional look at it, but re-bedding a keel isn't really a big deal, if it is even required. Sure it costs money, but that can be negotiated into the price.

In my opinion you should ALWAYS use a surveyor when buying a boat of any value, particularly if you don't have a lot of technical knowledge about boats.

[johannes]

I would say that what you see is probably not a problem, but I also agree that you should have a surveyor look at it.

[Charlie-Bravo]

Buying a yacht involves spending money, then once you own her more money will need to be spent to get her as you would want her, then more money just to berth, it's an on going thing. Having just purchased a 35  it looks like you should budget for the worst case and get a yard quote for dropping the keel, then take this to the broker and owner to sound out how receptive they are to donating money to fix her. If receptive, then get her surveyed, then come to an agreement of price reduction depending on what the surveyor finds, if they only scoff, and treat you like a newby, walk away and find another boat, ......... as you walk away they often change their tune and come up with some money to keep you in the sale.
Really hope it all goes well for you, but please remember that you will spend probably 10 to 20% more than the purchase price in the first year just getting her up to scratch, don't expect the owner to give you 20% off, but get as much as you can towards new rigging, heating , holding tank, sails, spray hood, cockpit encloseure, anchor, chain , batteries, and the electronics that just might die on you.
With luck some of the above list won't be needed, but generally it seems folk don't sell boats when everything is working well.

Good luck
CB

[johannes]

"....you will spend probably 10 to 20% more than the purchase price..."

I'm sure you mean "10 to 20% of the purchase price"? 

[bobtheboatman]

Thanks for all your answers,

I definitely will have a surveyor look at it, after reading your thoughts.

And I sure hope Charlie-Bravo means 10-20% of the purchase price!

I am still open to other inputs, and to here if this is a common issue.
I looked around at other boats in the sales harbor, and  some of them showed the same issue.
I hope the seller is not just selling boats with keel issues.

[Charlie-Bravo]

Um, yep, doesn't quite read well, buy for about £50 K and you can soon find that £60k has been spent on improvements, hopefully less, but doesn't seem to be that way for me, perhaps I like too many toys and everything working well.

[Charlie-Bravo]

Still doesn’t read well ...... must get a grip !
Buy for £50k and you could well spend another £10k ........ that’s better.

[jdl01]

I agree with the recommendations for a survey. The condition you show is common to older iron keel boats -
the hull/keel sealant breaks down along with the seal coat on the top of the iron keel. Seawater penetrates with slight keel movement as keel bolts ease slightly over time. Rust flowers develop and burst out at the the hull/keel joint. When the boat is on the lifter, prior to setting it on its keel, thoroughly dry the hull/keel joint. Then watch closely as the boat is lowered onto the keel. If water appears at the join as weight goes on the keel, its time to tighten the keel bolts. The proper long term solution is to drop and rebed the keel after scraping and resealing the top of it as suggested by Zapod.

[so40gtb]

Having battled keel rust on both a SO34.2 and our SO40, I'm a bit surprised at where your evidence of rust is located. My encounters were mostly on the keel and bulb, well below the hull joint, but ours were/are Great Lakes fresh water boats. I certainly concur with Don regarding the value of a survey. Re-bedding the hull/keel joint isn't unheard of - I considered that a few years ago and then the (very limited) observable rust seemed to vanish, probably due to better pre-launch preparation. What's important with these boats is to keep after any rust seen - grind it out, re-prime and re-paint isolated spots annually, consult experts when it's more extensive and following a pattern. A Beneteau First 36.7 stored in the same yard as our boat, had a horrific case of keel rash, after repeated years of neglect, and it took the new owner two months to clean it up.

[so32foot]

On your picture I do not see anything to worry about. The keel connection on my 2004 SO 32 looked the same. Probably it's a cosmetic problem, which easily can be checked by scraping of the sealant as far as possible beteewn the full and keel. Check then if remaining sealant is ok or not. If OK just bring up, after cleaning a new cosmetic seal.

But is a nice reason to negotiate the price further down and/or take a condtion in the contract that the current owner will pay the cost if it appears to be a serious problem.

[zaphod]

Jan 2, 2020 2:48:38 GMT so40gtb said:

A Beneteau First 36.7 stored in the same yard as our boat, had a horrific case of keel rash, after repeated years of neglect, and it took the new owner two months to clean it up.

That's odd, considering the Beneteau 36.7 has a lead keel...